MIOS Acquisition

Great to see the warm welcome and candor w/ Melih. Suffice to say, we’re very excited about the acquisition and the expansion of resources that will follow. There is a great synergy in vision and overall outlook on the smart home space.

As previously touched on by Melih, we’ve made a very significant commitment on additional resources. Including those needed to implement our next generation user interface. This will serve to provide a much more extensible and personalized experience, benefiting both the development community/power users, as well as mainstream customers. It’ll help us straddle that fragile balance much more adroitly than we did in the transition from UI5 to UI7.

Have attached some of the initial comps to give a sneak peek as to what’s next, so to speak (user selectable device icons, full theme support, home occupancy, etc).

More to follow. Soon. As always, we value the early feedback.

To that end, as part of the renewed focus on the forums, associated developer community, and our customer base as whole, we’ll round back in the coming weeks on a Product Advisory Board and major overhaul to the beta process, as previously discussed. Lots of exciting stuff in motion over here. You’ll all be well pleased with the changes to come.

Keep the input coming… we’re listening!

Without a doubt! The PLEG plugin is perhaps the most important app to fully automate your home.

[quote=“zedrally, post:61, topic:199656”]PLEG:
without doubt he single most valuable PI available.[/quote]

Vera’s always been a love/hate system for me. It’s like a honor roll kid that goes on to work some lame job because he’s just fine with “good enough”. So much potential but a serious lack of something that’s a little hard to put your finger on…

I’m hoping that many of the suggested changes occur, and that it happens with minimal disruption to my current system. I think the automation and remote access should be free and the apps should be a 1x cost. I also think a priority should be put into getting it to work with Alexa/Google. As my system currently is, I’m the primary user that turns things on/off. When I had it tied into Google using the HABridge, my ENTIRE family used it pretty much evenly (including grandparents!). It was much easier to justify cost and time spent when the entire family benefited equally.

I am very happy to see MiOS getting some additional resources.

I’ve been a user of Vera for about 5 years now and have been fairly happy and not have many issues to be honest. Though; as my system has been growing and gone from a couple of devices to well over 100, I am starting to feel the shortcommings and pain with Vera.

New UI and so is all nice but for me stability and compabillity is the most important thing I think. After that I would like to see proper network tools. Trying to solve z-wave related issues with Vera are pretty much just fumbling in the dark guessing whats going on. I would love to see a proper network graph over which devices talk to each other. What devices are causing issues in a network and tools to properly address issues. Since I am a software developer my self; I would love to see a much more proper way to integrate with Vera than today. Preferly in a way which is not language bound so developers can use any language best suited for them.

Program Logic Event Generator (PLEG) (for real automation)
DSC Alarm Panel Plugin (for alarm system integration)
EventWatcher (for system monitoring - for the love of god why aren’t tools like this native?)
VeraAlerts (for more valuable user notification options than native)

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Everyone, Poll is opened here: :smiley:

Is there any specific capability or device we should integrate natively?

[quote=“Colin Burke McClure, post:68, topic:199656”]…
Have attached some of the initial comps to give a sneak peek as to what’s next, so to speak (user selectable device icons, full theme support, home occupancy, etc).
…[/quote]

Looks great !

Program Logic Event Generator (PLEG) (for real automation)
DSC Alarm Panel Plugin (for alarm system integration)
EventWatcher (for system monitoring - for the love of god why aren’t tools like this native?)
VeraAlerts (for more valuable user notification options than native)[/quote]

Seems the original comment is gone?

At any rate, MiOS can’t “take” these. They are the works of others. If they want them they need to pay for them and bring on the plugin developer under contract to maintain and improve it.

Everytime I log into the forums that don’t use HTTPS and enter my username and password in plain text I get an uneasy feeling of if Vera has a security first culture. You have an always on connection to my network but don’t follow a very basic best practice. Yes, I get it’s a forum. It’s also a username and password and people are lazy, that’s why they have home automation :slight_smile:

1 Like

Hello @Melih

I’ve only just heard about this news! Which I hope is good news. :slight_smile:

I’ve been a Vera customer since around 2010 and I have purchased several different Vera units.

Overall I have generally been happy with Vera, though its not perfect, it has problems, but with the help of the Vera support team who I cannot really fault, as they have always fixed most of my serious issues, which is the only time I contact them, usually to do with Firmware updates gone wrong. One of the reasons why I stuck with Vera was the good technical support staff.

But there are been issues in the past and still today, the UI5 to UI7 migration several years ago was well a nightmare, I opted to build my system from scratch on UI7 rather than attempt the migration which hadn’t gone well for many others. UI7 firmware updates now are hit and miss, some have updated with no problems, others have gone badly wrong.

The UI7 web GUI in general is functional but needs improvement, as does the Vera mobile app, which I don’t use, on our Android phones and tablets I use the excellent 3rd party control app called Imperihome take a look at that !

Vera is very reliant on 3rd party developers and their plugins to fill the gaps in its product. Community developers of course are what we need, but they are filling in the gaps missing from what should already be part of the core Vera system, which is the problem.

You need to hire Richard Schaefer, without his plugins PLEG for logic operations, VeraAlerts for notifications and Vera Concierge for Google Home integration, my Vera would not be any where near as good. In fact I would have moved to another Home Automation platform by now, if it wasn’t for those plugins alone.

I have considered moving to Samsung SmartThings but their cloud dependency put me off, unlike Vera which runs locally without the Internet. But SmartThings has a larger range of Smart Home devices that it can integrate with, again mainly down to the community developers building device handlers.

Moving forward I would like Vera to:

  1. Work out the stability issues with firmware updates and the core system.
  2. Have a better web GUI and mobile app GUI and one that works with the various 3rd party plugins like the Imperihome app does.
  3. Quicker device integration in Vera for new Z-Wave and other smart home devices out on the market.
  4. Native Google Home and IFTTT integration and improved Alexa integration.
  5. Better support and help from the company for 3rd party developers, to build their plugins more easily and a better plugin market place.

I am happy to pay $100 for a controller hub and much more, if that hub is fast and has a good spec and is reliable and not cloud dependent.

A $20 controller that is slower and cannot support as many connected devices doesn’t interest me. I’ve never heard of eZLO before but I will have a further read of your website.

Thank you for your time and listening to your new customers.

Regards

Program Logic Event Generator (PLEG) (for real automation)
DSC Alarm Panel Plugin (for alarm system integration)
EventWatcher (for system monitoring - for the love of god why aren’t tools like this native?)
VeraAlerts (for more valuable user notification options than native)[/quote]

Seems the original comment is gone?

At any rate, MiOS can’t “take” these. They are the works of others. If they want them they need to pay for them and bring on the plugin developer under contract to maintain and improve it.[/quote]

I fully agree that the authors of these valuable plugins would need to be paid if these are co-opted.

However, I don’t think that they need to be integrated as-is. Most of these address a basic need that should have been included in the Vera core, but that doesn’t mean they should be copied exactly. What should be done is examine the underlying need and see how best to address it, which might not look like any of these plugins or even be a plugin.

Regardless, do consult the authors of these when addressing these issues, and pay them for their time.

While I agree, the functionalities of PLEG really should just be built in already (and now seems like the time to make that happen). We really shouldn’t need to pay for a plug-in to be able to have fine control over the system.

This sounds very promising, and could place my migration plans to HomeSeer on hold. But please, fix the stuff that doesn’t work.
I have invested a lot of time in Vera, but not a lot of money. Four controllers, and another four for my friends. That’s like $1.200 all together.
The total number of physical devices these systems are running is more than 150. Average price of $50? That’s more than $7.500,-, probably more like $10K

So, I do not understand the focus on getting the controller price down. It is a small part of the total cost, how can that be important? Are you looking at another business model all together? Subscription based? Ok, that’s when I leave the building for sure. Rather pay $400 for the controller, easily!
Seriously, I had purchased HomeSeer software for $600 already if I just had the time to migrate. The Z-wave stick and a tiny PC is already sitting on my desk ready for it.
I can understand it if you also plan to launch a bunch of cheaper devices. It is the device cost that is crazy, not the controller.

[quote=“melih, post:60, topic:199656”]We very much value the development ecosystem and all the good work developers have done with their plugins… We are trying to see how we can increase their value in this ecosystem…
Is there any specific plugins you think we should take and integrate natively? Maybe we should start a post to get everyone to vote ?[/quote]

Plugins to integrate natively? Perhaps these three -

Logitech Harmony Hub plugin for Vera is excellent and very powerful.
Philips Hue plugin which I believe is now managed by the Vera team, there is also an improved Alternative version done by a 3rd party.
PLEG For more complex logic operations within Vera that native Vera scenes simply cannot do.

This is a list of plugins I am dependent on and that are installed on my VeraPlus unit:

Program Logic Core PLC (For more complex logic operations within Vera that native Vera scenes cannot do)
Program Logic Event Generator PLEG (For more complex logic operations within Vera that native Vera scenes cannot do)
Squeezebox Control (Legacy - I used this for connecting my Logitech Squeezebox audio devices in to Vera)
DLNA Media Controller (Currently partly broken - Used to link Kodi HTPCs and other DLNA devices into Vera for basic playback transport controls)
UPnP Event Proxy
WOLPlusPing (Simple WOL plugin can be used to turn on / off PCs etc).
Kodi Remote (Links Kodi HTPC current playback status into Vera, dim lights on play and brighten on pause etc)
Day or Night (Simple plugin shows a Day or Night button as current, can be used in logic)
MultiSwitch (Plugin with 8 virtual switches to program logic against)
VeraAlerts (Notification plugin - email, mobile app alerts, TTS announcements etc)
CurrentCost EnviR Energy Monitor (Integrates the CurrentCost Electric Energy monitor in to Vera)
ImperiHome (Links Vera to the Imperihome mobile control app for TTS announcements and more)
RGB Controller (Plugin for RGBW modules like Fibaro and others for improved functionality in Vera)
Philips Hue 2 (Plugin for Philips Hue bridge integration)
Countdown timer (A simple count down timer plugin, used with my alarm setup for door entry, give us time to disarm the house)
Harmony Hub Control (Logitech Harmony plugin most excellent!)
Wunderground Weather Plugin (Adds some weather devices into Vera Current Temp / High Low Temp / Windspeed / Humidity)
Magic Home Wifi LED Control (Plugin to control cheap WIFI RGB LED controllers, use it with some LED strips)

While I agree, the functionalities of PLEG really should just be built in already (and now seems like the time to make that happen). We really shouldn’t need to pay for a plug-in to be able to have fine control over the system.[/quote]

Totally agree, that kind of functionality should be built in, in a much more user friendly way. My brain doesn’t understand PLEG UI logic at all, so I write LUA code instead to do what I want. Shouldn’t be necessary.

[quote=“Thorden, post:80, topic:199656”]So, I do not understand the focus on getting the controller price down. It is a small part of the total cost, how can that be important? Are you looking at another business model all together? Subscription based? Ok, that’s when I leave the building for sure. Rather pay $400 for the controller, easily!
I can understand it if you also plan to launch a bunch of cheaper devices. It is the device cost that is crazy, not the controller.[/quote]

I totally agree with this, I cannot see the point in buying a $20 controller hub when your spending $100’s or more likely $1000’s on the devices to link in to it.

I would be happy to pay up to $400 max for a decent controller. Ideally I have been happy paying around ?150 GBP for my VeraPlus what’s that in dollars? $190 odd.

Why cheap out on the controller hardware / cost, if its not gonna be up to the job ?

Great if you can sell my a $20 controller that is as good as a $200 one but I doubt it.

[quote=“sivaprasath, post:52, topic:199656”]I am totally against the subscription model for Vera. Vera’s selling point is (As per the website www.getvera.com)

NO MONTHLY FEES. NO CONTRACTS. NO HASSLES.
WHY PAY ANOTHER MONTHLY BILL THAT YOU DON?T NEED? THE ONGOING FEES FROM OUR COMPETITORS ADD UP QUICKLY AND COST YOU BIG TIME. WITH VERA, THERE ARE NO MONTHLY FEES ? JUST EVERYDAY BENEFITS!
[/quote]

Im a huge supporter of this model too, It’s the reason I bought my Vera Plus, that and it still works if Australia’s tin-can broadband network fails when it rains (which it does a lot).

[quote=“zedrally, post:61, topic:199656”]PLEG:
without doubt he single most valuable PI available.[/quote]

I’m in IT (ex server admin who still likes to tinker) and I found PLEG to be an incomprehensible, user hostile pile of junk - I actually found building my own HAC using Hass.io several orders of magnitude easier than learning PLEG … and that involves editing half a dozen YAML files to get anything done!

PLEG is a great example of when programmers dont understand how to make a user friendly UI - there’s just no excuse for it these days imo.

[quote=“dJOS, post:85, topic:199656”][quote=“zedrally, post:61, topic:199656”]PLEG:
without doubt he single most valuable PI available.[/quote]

I’m in IT (ex server admin who still likes to tinker) and I found PLEG to be an incomprehensible, user hostile pile of junk - I actually found building my own HAC using Hass.io several orders of magnitude easier than learning PLEG … and that involves editing half a dozen YAML files to get anything done!

PLEG is a great example of when programmers dont understand how to make a user friendly UI - there’s just no excuse for it these days imo.[/quote]

I don’t know about this, I am terrible at writing code but with PLEG which I agree does have a learning curve, however I am now able to setup some quite complex logic operations to suit my needs that otherwise I would not have been able to do.

[quote=“cw-kid, post:86, topic:199656”][quote=“dJOS, post:85, topic:199656”][quote=“zedrally, post:61, topic:199656”]PLEG:
without doubt he single most valuable PI available.[/quote]

I’m in IT (ex server admin who still likes to tinker) and I found PLEG to be an incomprehensible, user hostile pile of junk - I actually found building my own HAC using Hass.io several orders of magnitude easier than learning PLEG … and that involves editing half a dozen YAML files to get anything done!

PLEG is a great example of when programmers dont understand how to make a user friendly UI - there’s just no excuse for it these days imo.[/quote]

I don’t know about this, I am terrible at writing code but with PLEG which I agree does have a learning curve, however I am now able to setup some quite complex logic operations to suit my needs that otherwise I would not have been able to do.[/quote]

I was more confused after reading the manual than before when I’d just had a poke around the UI.

I’m using node-red on hassio and was up and running after watching a video.